Category: interviews (Page 3 of 4)

Mr. Moore,

Thanks for your cooperation. If I may ask you a few more questions.

1) Do you remember a time when Doug Edson ran for selectman in Warwick?

2) When you came back to the commune, what shocked you? What changes did you see in the community and it Michael?

3) Who is this Debbie you speak of? What’s her last name?

4) Was the policy of no drugs no alcohol, no promiscuity taken seriously while you were there?

5) Do you know how Michael managed to avoid the draft?

6) When you came back to the commune in 1974, what kind of car was Michael driving?

7) What were some of your past lives? Do you remember anyone else’s?

8) Do you remember any Vietnam veterans in the commune?

9) Do you remember a guy named Timm from Alabama who was a Vietnam vet and recovering heroin addict?

10) Do you remember a violent Vietnam veteran named Johnny who had spent some time in jail and arrived with a girl named Crickett?

11) Did people talk a lot about erath changes? Do you remember any talk about space aliens?

12) Do you remember an incident in which someone threw a Molitov cocktail at the Warwick house?

13) Is Leah Garland the same person as Leah Odess?

14) Were you there when they stormed a talk show? Do you remember if it was more than one talk show?

15) I read in one article that commune members believed that they were reincrnated from “an Indian tribe, Atlantean rebels, or a band of 18th century pirates”. Is that true?

16) Did Michael know who the next Christ was, and when he was going to come?

Thanks a lot.

BEN

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hi, ben. No, I was not there when someone ran for selectman, for the storming Of a talk show, etc. I was there when a commune member was murdered when he was hitching.

It was Debbie Havermale. She was from a wealthy Jewish Baltimore family, who didn’t take kindly to me… To put it mildly! She went to Princeton as one of the first female students. But she dropped out and went to the community with her boyfriend.

it was less than two years later when I went back. I had a “feeling ” that Michael had gone off the track. So when we went to New York city from Santa Fe to look for a place to live, we went to the community as a side trip to see if there was anything I could do. At that time the community owned a block of Turners Falls. The big news was they just bought a fleet of Japanese minivans! Extremely materialistic! Michael was chain smoking and acting like a junkie. Wouldn’t listen to me. So it was a short “meeting. “

Dale, who had just disassociated himself from Michael and the community [now a church] met with me that night at my motel room to fill me in on what happened, Michael’s addiction, etc. Dale told me how one of the girls who had taken
care of me had come into an inheritance, signed it over to the church… And then Michael kicked her out. I saw the seeds of this when I lived there. But it was not starting to decay.

I would bet some snuck a cigarette or a joint somewhere in secret… And i don’t know what the “core group ” did or didn’t do. But I did not see drugs or booze there. I did pot and experimented tripping before I went to the community. But I followed the rule about drugs. And I never was a drinker or a smoker. The rule about no casual sex was more vague and was often stretched. but on the commune’s list serve they now say that Warwick was a hot bed of orgies! Where was I?!

There were a lot of Vietnam vets back then!

Ah, the soap opera of past lives. It kept changing every few months! Soap operas are glamorous
fogs covering real life! Past lives are useful as personal myth to project relationship dynamics upon to objectify them. But back then everybody had been either a famous character or the handmaiden of a famous character! Me? I was a Jewish Scribe, a Greek librarian, and a Chinese “holy bandit ” [con man].

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

(from Rafael:)

No, not expectations Frank: If you expect, it leads to deception, and you get weaker.

Espérer ne veut pas nécessairement dire avoir des attentes, malgré que ça va ensemble, c’est vrai…

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you mean pictures of what SHOULD be… Which limit possibilities. But reality tends to be shaped by expectations. High expectations without pictures is the best, the most unlimited. Life is a battle of expectations.

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

Frank,

I couldn’t stop reading: passionating; Actually of very fuckedup story from a youngster’s like myself point of view…

Driven by a dream, anything is possible with a dream for I believe dreamers shape reality 🙂

Rafael

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yep, dreams and expectations shape reality.

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

Mr. Moore,

I understand that you once belonged to the Brotherhood of the Spirit/Renaissance Community.

I am currently writing a novel that will involve the commune to some extent. Consequently, I have been researching the commune for several months now. I will talk to absolutely anyone who has firsthand experience with the commune. I would love to talk to you, if you would be at all interested in talking to me.

I have talked to a number of people whose names I am sure you will recognize, including: Paul Skiathitis, Susan Weiss, John Carpini, Eric Hardendorf, Tom Snyder, Larry Raffel, Jim Baker, May Ristich, Cindy Prince, Melvin Weiner, Jacki Odess-Gillet, Bruce Geisler, and others.

If you’re interested in talking, shoot me an email.

BEN DUFFY

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sure!

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

* * * * *

Mr. Moore,

I would begin by asking you:

1) When and why did you come to the commune?

2) When and why did you leave the commune?

3) What aspect of the commune were you involved with? I mean, did you work in any of the businesses, were you involved in the church, did you write for Free Spirit Press, etc?

Thanks a lot. I eagerly await your response.

BEN

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well, ben… Here it is! Ask more questions!

Well, Ben, I was there from early summer 71 to late summer the next year. I was living in Santa Fe for the year before that. Do you know I have cerebral palsy? I am in a wheelchair, talk by a head pointer and a communication board, etc. it’s only important for this tale. So in Santa Fe, I was basically a hippy, writing for the underground paper, living communally, visiting the major communes in northern New Mexico… Morningstar, the Hog Farm, The Theater of All Possibilities, etc. When I first got to Santa Fe, I lived in a Digger-style of commune, The Center, for two months. Then I lived with Louise Scott who was living communally in San Bernardino when I was going to college there. I lived with Louise, her eight year old son and her thirteen year old daughter Denise as well as various other people in various houses. Most people then knew me as Unicorn because of my head pointer. My column in the underground paper was called UNICORN SPEAKS. The general vibe of northern New Mexico was communally spiritual.

But I grew too comfortable there. And I knew that Louise wanted to move to the land. I ain’t a land kind of guy. And I was intimately lonely, wasn’t finding that kind of relationship. But we need to be clear. I had a rich, full, fun life there, full of friends, political and social activities, deep spiritual exploring. A lot of music and dancing! In fact Robert Downing Sr. saw me dancing at the local bar and offered me a role in his movie Greaser Palace.

But practically the next day I was volunteering at the crisis center, which was the latest version of the digger commune. There a couple was putting up posters that said “SPIRIT IN FLESH IS COMING! “ We started talking. They had an inner shine common to Yoga people and other cults. [I use the word “cults “ as a description, not a value judgment.] They told me about the commune they lived in in northern Massachusetts. Bonnie and Allen, the couple, were traveling around the country fliering for the commune’s band, Spirit in Flesh. They walked home with Denise and me, telling me I should come to the community. With 250 people there, they could deal with my physical needs, etc.

Well, that sounded good to me. And Bonnie was sexy, warm, etc. With 250 people maybe I’d find some one…

When I told Louise and my other friends about my decision, they were more than a little concerned. But they supported me. I put a sign in the record store for a ride to Massachusetts. A brother and sister answered. They had been students in the community free high school who were off to college in Vermont. We all often went to community dances. So we knew one another that way. So I traveled across the country in the back of their station wagon. They fed me, etc.

One problem. I beat Allen and Bonnie back to Massachusetts. So when the kids dropped me off at the commune’s house in Northfield, there was less than eager acceptance! But there was no way to send the crip back! And the two kids needed to be on their way to Vermont! So the vexed community members milled around me on the front yard, trying to figure out what to do with me. At one point, Michael, the leader of the community and the lead singer of Spirit in Flesh, walked up. In New Mexico I had been in contact with “holy men“, gurus, spiritual teachers, etc. The good ones saw some aspects of what they did as cons, saw themselves with a twinkling sense of humor, and had a certain lust for life that could be mistaken for being dirty old men. So after they had filled him in, I spelled out “I am a con man too. “ He just said, “he stays. I have been waiting for you.“ And he walked on. So that was that. Some women brought me in to the house, fed me, cleaned me up, etc. I thought my luck was holding. After the original freak out, the people in the house were warm.

That evening there was by chance a free Spirit in Flesh concert in Greenfield that the Northfield people were allowed to go to. It was an outdoor event. It was my first time hearing /seeing the band. Pretty good! So I started dancing in my wheelchair in the audience. But community members quickly frowned me down. My dancing was “carnal“! And besides a cripple dancing was disturbing the audience! I started wondering about my luck!

And that wondering intensified when I moved to Warwick the next day and attended my first COMMUNITY MEETING. Michael’s talk was alternately down to earth and pure spiritual nonsense! And afterwards most people said Michael had said the exact opposite than he had said. Beam me up, Scotty! Moreover, people kept coming up to me to say I must have done awful things in my past lives considering how ugly and physically fucked up I was! I wondered what they did in their past lives to be rude and spiritually stupid! But there I was. So better work with it! And Michael worked with me in a remote manner to create a personal myth around me, protecting me from the popular social game of brutal confrontation. First he said he wanted me to dance on the stage at the big concert at Carnegie Half a couple of months from then. This confused the people who thought I was carnal, etc. Then he added I was the same as him, saw the same as him, and he was preparing the world for me to do my thing. All of this confused people, made them treat me differently, carefully. I thought Michael had good intentions, but was so way over his head. He did not know how the world works. He did not think 250 people living happily in the community was enough to change the world. So he got seduced by glamour, by trying to be a success, a rock star, etc.

For the first couple of months I floated, mainly hanging out in the hallway outside of the kitchen at Warwick, talking to people, asking people to feed me, give me a drink, help me in the bathroom, etc. I made good friends. I also painted oils and typed on my electric typewriter poetry and a novel in the dining-room. But floating is a hard way to live, especially eating beets and rice. So I ended up in the hospital with pneumonia, almost dying. Michael visited me in the hospital and appointed Russell and Sammy to me. Also he gave me special food money. When I got out of the hospital, Russell, Sammy and I shared a room in the Warwick main house. We became like the Three musketeers… Bad Boys. We traveled just below the commune’s rules, going outside of the community, hitching into adventures. Russell and I always pulling the fearful Sammy along. But Sammy always finally jumped! We traveled to the cities where the band was playing and talked to people, etc. and became a part of the concerts… All of this was against commune’s rules. But when THEY tried to bust us, kick us out of the van, whatever, Michael over ruled them, which confused them, stretching their reality. This was one of my roles. Things were leading up to the big concert at Carnegie Hall. Basically we three lived by our wits, without money, in New York City for the week before the concert, mainly hanging out in the Village… Sneaking into THE GASLIGHT and backstage… Having a wheelchair race down Beaker Street at two in the morning with a Vietnam vet, etc. The climax was me dancing on stage! And my first big public performance made it into CREAM MAGAZINE!

But after that, Russell wanted to move “up “ in the commune’s structure. So they moved me to Northfield. I again floated, but in a slightly more stable situation. I always was talking about how people needed to be more gentle with one another, be down to earth, and not so caught up in “spiritual “ glamour. This was not a politically correct stand right then, although there were a lot of gentle, down to earth people there. But at the time there was a fad, a plague, of channeling/automatic writings sweeping Northfield. It was supported by Michael’s sister, Jacquelyn [“Jackie “] and was pushed by Robin Paris, who had a strange relationship with the target of my romantic intentions, Debbie. One day Robin went into a trance and a spirit came through claiming to be my spirit. I happened to be in the room at the time. At first it built me up, flattering me. But when I kept saying “that ain’t me, my spirit” it started yelling at me, listing what a carnal shit I was, etc. This event put the breaks on the channeling /automatic writings fad! Debbie was officially moved back to Warwick in disgrace. [Warwick was the bottom of the ladder.] So I asked to be moved back to Warwick to be close to her. But she, Robin and Jackie disappeared for months. They were hiding out in New York City. Years later I would buy the loft they had used.

So in Warwick this go around, I lived in the plasticed-in porch. I became a night person to avoid most of the soap opera confrontations. So my room became a hang out for the creative people. There were two girls who mainly took care of me. Each often slept in my bed with me. Nothing sexual. Just cuddling. That is how dumb I was! But it played into my carnal reputation. In reality I was a virgin. Actually this was one of the things Michael worked on with me. One time he “gave” me his girlfriend for a week to show me how a woman should treat me. Unfortunately I did not know what he meant by “gave. “ So I didn’t take full advantage of his offer. Another time at a group meeting, Michael made a pronouncement: “Frank needs sex! “ I wasn’t at that meeting. I happened to be having my first actual fully sexual experience with my close friend, one of the back up singers. Because we had the love of friends, it was deep and rich. But because I was so romantically focused on Debbie, it was a one time thing. [Darn!] But it did set the frame for the week of strange sexual encounters with women who wanted to follow Michael’s directions by fucking me. Pretty shallow, not satisfying. I decided to hold out for Debbie.

Most of the people would not listen to me when I tried to tell them this spiritual glamour was spacing them out of this human life. But then one day, when I was typing, a spirit who later introduced himself as Reed, came through me, typing, “You are not typing this, Frank”. At the beginning, I thought I made Reed up to get the people to listen, and to start creating my ideals in the world. But I may have been taking more credit than I deserved because Reed and two other spirits/characters/persons took on a reality of their own . People waited for the next “lecture” to come through. The spirits talked to people, guiding them (and me) to create a new personal community. I was saying the exact same things I had before. But now this spirit was saying it! People were listening seriously. Ah, the holy con job. Professor Beth and her husband… Who got both Michael and Elwood into their “spiritual careers”… Actually approached me to be the next Elwood. I declined.

To make a long story short, Debbie reappeared. I went for what I wanted with her, with the help of Reed. We got married. But it soon became clear that to have a strong personal relationship would have come in to conflict with certain commune’s factions. Jackie was trying to force Debbie to go apple picking for a month! I saw the writing on the wall. So we left. It was a little more than a year after I arrived.

I have tried over the years to manifest the core of what the Brotherhood of the Spirit was trying to do. I am satisfied! I went back about two years later. I was shocked by what the community and Michael had become.

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

Annie, attached is your interview with Karen!

Can we put it up?

In Freedom,
Frank Moore

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Frank,
Thanks. You shouldn’t have gone thru all this trouble.
It will be fun to read.
Annie

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hey, it is history!

In Freedom,
Frank Moore